My attempt at a matchup guide.

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Zombiebrian
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Re: My attempt at a matchup guide.

Postby Zombiebrian » Sun Sep 13, 2009 6:34 am

Just a note i will get back to my matchup guide when i regain form, however i have recently returned to winning ways and i have came to the conclusion that these pages and guides are more like tips of certain moves that work well and common problems with the matchups if you focus to much on the tips and guides you can come to the conclusion that these are how you should be playing and thats a disguised flaw.

How to play the match and general tips are one and two different things. :D
Angry old survivor from 2009 eventhubs :evil:

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Re: My attempt at a matchup guide.

Postby Grifpuma » Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:50 pm

Here is a brief vega matchup guide that I will update. Feel free to correct me on things, some of these people I hardly fight ever so it is hard to tell what to do when I do.

Ryu: Ugh, shotos. Your best bet here is to try walldive a ton. Ryu's are typically easier then Kens, but not by much. At mid screen, you want to try and back up so he doesn't rush down you. Then once at a full screen distance, you can do a few things. If he fireball spams, this depends on if you have meter/ultra or not. If ultra, launch it at him and punish his ass. If you have meter, punish him with an EX SHC. From then on, until he downs you, just FBA him with crossups. If he tries to jump and AA you be prepared to hit punch on reaction to izuna drop him before he hits you. Your poking game is crucial to keep him away, but also try and bait him with pokes. Even Dan can DP during you pokes so throw out a c.MP and wait for the DP and punish it.

Ken: See ryu. The only major difference is that Ken is more of a rush down player, so don't expect him to sit there and fireball you. Try and bait out DP's and punish those.

Chun-li: This match can go either way. If the chun doesn't try and rush down you, you have won. Keep walldiving and hit and running, and you will win this fight. Chun doesn't have much anti air, and the one she does (EX SBK) will knock you away for minimal damage and make her use meter.

E. Honda: This guy is a tough one. Headbutt is safe on guard and is very easy to punish guarded or whiffed walldives with. If he plays a defensive style, try and inch your way up and grab him a ton. Cross him up with the FBA and just do what you can to make sure he doesn't have charge. I'm pretty sure sumo slam isn't safe on guard so make sure to punish those.

Blanka: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: AUGH. I don't even know where to start. Nothing seems to work at all. The only things I can say to do are to use the last active frames of your slide kick to hit his electricity and use standing HK if you see a foward roll coming. Don't walldive. Just don't, for your sake and for mine.

Zangief: A tough match up, but not impossible. HK and c.HP are your friends here. Keep your range and don't let him get in on you. Use a backflip when you get up to avoid the normal gief lariat or grab wakeups.

Guile: Flash kicks are you biggest enemy here. Worse then even a DP for your walldives, you are going to have to creative here. Instead of doing a FBA, try instead to jump off and zoom right behind him. It should dodge the flash kick, but be careful, if he doesn't use one you will be very open for attack. For the rush down guiles? Well, good luck with that. If you figure that out tell me because I would love to know!

Dhalsim: It all depends on the player for this match. Luckily, most sim's are teleporting HP'ing guys so you will plow right through them. Walldive them to death and abuse his floaty jump to get some very high priority air grabs in there.

Boxer: Another tough one. A very defensive character with a great anti air move, it is very hard to get in on boxer's. Try and do crossup FBA's but be wary, he will probably wise up to it sooner or later. Use Vega's overhead (Edit: Vega doesn't have an overhead. His :joystick-down-right: :kick-medium: can be blocked low, which sucks.). Depending on how turtly he is, you might be able to spam grabs. Just walk right up to him and throw 'em. Then you can have your fun, spamming walldives on his wakeup so he won't be able to react as fast.

Claw: Ah, a mirror match. This really depends how how much you know your own weaknesses and strengths! One strength being his air grab! Use this A LOT. I feel that I cannot stress this enough, use and abuse this on his walldives.

Sagat: Hit. And. Run. Stay far, far away from this guy. Your combos only do about as much as a single HK to you so don't try to rush in. Let him come to you. If you have meter/ultra, punish his tiger shot spams. If not, backflip and let him come to you. FBA and crosshim up, izuna drop if he trys to AA you. This is an uphill fight the whole way, but eventually you will climb the mountain.

Dictator: Arg, I hate this match as well. The second worst matchup right behind blanka. Dictator controls the air and the ground. Walldives will be met with Devil reverses. Keep it to a minimum, if at all. You will pretty much be guarding and looking for opportunities to do a c.MP and combo off that into either a M RCF or an EX FBA. Good luck, you'll need it.

I'll do the rest later, but I feel this most of the more popular characters.

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Re: My attempt at a matchup guide.

Postby air-reez » Tue Sep 22, 2009 9:28 pm

M.Bsion (Dictator) vs. Blanka

This match up is the most frustrating you can ever play as Bison, but lucky for me I played everyday with a Blanka player allowing me to learn his tricks and beat him everytime. (I still have trouble with alot online). This match requires Patience.

Right off the bat many Blankas will start off with a :punch-light: roll and attempt to throw. Be on guard for this by immediately backing up and prepare to throw cancel. This helps you out in the chance they perform a stronger roll attack.

In the case Blanka attempts to hit you with a roll attack you must block and after toss out a :kick-hard: Scissor. Usually you'll only get one hit, but it's a fair trade for the chip damage you take. You'll want to time your scissor for when Blanka is at the apex of his roll back.

Blanka also has that Overhead roll attack. You can block that and hit him with a standing :kick-hard: . The EX overhead roll can Cross up even at opposite ends of the screen, and I think the Blanka player has some control over it's distance. In this case you have 2 options: 1. Judge the distance, Block Standing :kick-hard: 2. Evade it altogether by Slide Crouching :kick-hard: or teleport.

One thing when facing Blanka is you never want to do any HeadStomps, or Devil reverses from Mid - long range. Blanka's Anti air roll will knock you out of the air no matter what. Even at close range you don't want to take the chance of Blanka just hitting you with his electricity.

If you haven't noticed already You have to pretty much turtle against Blanka, so this may convince him to come in close and attempt to actually fight. Watch for the long active hit frames, on Blankas crouching :punch-hard: . Punish that on block.

Sometimes Blanka will come in throw a few attacks, followed by his standing double knee attack (sorry don't know the button combo). Usually they will crouching :punch-light: or :kick-light: after, then attempt a jumping cross up attack. Immediately after the low short/jab take a standing step back and hit him out of the air with standing :kick-hard:, If you have trouble with that throw out an EX Headstomp/ devil reverse. The window is small, but it can be done.

Lastly many Blanka players get frustrated/ desparate when you're handling them. In this case they will attempt to hit you with their Ultra any time you do anything. Use this opportunity to (I know I advised against it) throw out a Devil reverse from across the screen, and bring it all the way back. Chances are the Blanka will bite, and throw out a wasted Ultra. This gives you the chance to block, and ultra (Scissor kick if you don't have revenge).

I hate doing it, but you have to turtle against a turtling Blanka.
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Re: My attempt at a matchup guide.

Postby Assassin » Fri Oct 16, 2009 10:05 am

great matchup Grif

here I'll just add a few of my Vega (Claw) notes for the arcade charcters, i dont play any console characters except in CPU hardest, which isnt very useful

Abel

against Abel the full backslash works well as his entire game relies heavily on closing distance and keeping you within reach. that said, play your game with Abel just beyond arms reach. Do not RCF him with anything other than LP as he's gurateed to throw you out of it. HK slide works well when he's rolling towards you, he can also be thrown out of his roll pretty easily. a good Abel will play very strong rush down game, that can kill you before you have time to do much, so distance is really priority one

use your long jabs (MK, HP, Cr.MP), scarlet terror has a high chance of success as he will always be rushing you down, use the strike, pause, Strike with ST method. As his game is heavily reliant on Focus Attacks, you need to use closer strikes / combos with caution. his EX moves are very dangerous, opt for backslash if in doubt. and dont get caught by his Change of Direction, jump back and strike religiously, as if your life depended on it, or go for Sky High Claw off your back wall


Akuma

a good Akuma player knows his only hope is to destroy mercilessly without giving the opponent any opportunity to react, but he does so with tact and a lot effort as opposed to other characters with limitless combos. FA fwd dashes are a good way to advance on a fireball, as are HK slides and Fwd Dashes, . Well-timed very accurate FBA's to Izunas are very good possiblities. once he starts closing in on you the lights could be going out , EX RCF's are great for his triple fireball and air fireballs, to catch him as he's landing, scarlet terrors may not work all that well due to priority and angles. jumping with HP and using your pokes is useful, but are going to have to be used according to his delay/pause game which if untimed will leave you without a claw and pretty badly beaten. dont go to daring into your combos, be equally prepared to jump back should the first stick not land. Sticking and moving, sticking and moving is a good way to keep yourself at a safer distance (you arent keeping him at bay, ur keeping yourself out of harms way, he will own you otherwise)


Balrog (Boxer)

knowing when to block high or low is essential to beat Balrog, as defense is all thats going to win you this round. keep him away by jumping back and HP/HK as well as with your longest pokes. LK to throw is a move that works very well against his straight in charge and spinning attacks, if hes far enough away you may get away with a fwd dash to LK to throw or combo. if you can't fwd dash because he's too close, go ahead and just walk forward as far as possible until you meet his charge move at the last second with your LK snuff. The rebound on the light kick is enough to give you a regular throw if timed correctly, you can link 2 LK's as well, then into a kara throw. if you have an Ultra, wait until your back wall is approaching then put yourself even closer to the back wall by half backslashing, then throw out your Ultra at the very last possible frame you are still safe to land it before he hits you. your Ultra owns all of his charging moves if your in the corner, if he's too close, poke him out with a cr.MP then throw out your ultra o your back wall


Blanka

save all EX for EXFBA to Izuna to punish his Rolls. stay on the ground. if he jumps up on you, jump straight up with HK or HP rather than try to out forward air strike him. Cr. MP his electricty (with your claw on), i swear i think I combo poked him 2 times in a row with cr MP from pretty close in his electricity, maybe he was EX? your HK strike can hit him and so can your jumping in/out HP at various places in his spin and from various distances, dont have all the various details just yet. a good technique with some of his spins is to simply jump straight up, and begin charging back, come straight down to a HP cancel to HP RCF. use CrLK and CrLP jabs during his cross up or half or full backslash. and watch out for his FA game, safer to throw out 2 crLP jabs than a crMP, and wait for the well-timed ST to break it. be quick with the counter throws, and back slash or straight up jump any slow rolls. dont slide on him except to break electricity that he's not about to ball out from. his electricity you may need to redistance yourself by back dashing or half-backslashing before your slide or cr. mp claw poke. if you want to get him out of his electricity when you want to izuna him, and you feel like burning EX, do the EX FBA to neutral position strike directly over his head, its likely yo get him jumping out of his Electricity next time he sees you flying over head


Chun Li

wait for Chunli, play it smart, she's fast, she's poweful, and she can hit you 100 times before you realize that you are no longer in control of the game, its controlling you. don't rush in, dont get crazy, dont underestimate her, the moment you don't respect her, she kills you. you need to play a balanced game of defense and offense, more defense than offense actually. blocking is key, she has several, scratch that, MANY multiple hit strikes, strikes which hit on different levels, requiring blocking high or low in an instant. her block string is a mighty powerful thing, her 3 crLP jab to button-slap crHP strike is a far-reaching unblockable death trap. back dashes are important in this match up because she can usually throw you after your backslashes. Poking from max range only get out and get in with minimal strikes and get out again, retreiting with more strikes, forward dashing with strikes, back dashing with strikes, escape jumps with strikes, etc. straight up jump strikes are a good counter to alot her moves, possibly the best counter. Up and MP can be used right off the ground and its lowest height. if you fly for a wall over her head or even approach her from the air you're very likely to get thrown out of whatever you were doing. ChunLi is one I have the hardest time with, and there is a flawless Chunli I play all the time King ChunLi, hands down teh best, and he was kind enough to explain some of my flaws to me. ChunLi's Vega's Rival, and for good reasons. EX ST is good for her over head drop heel slam if you get teh timing right, otherwise block high then counter. dont bother witht he Izuna drop unless she has NO EX, her EX spinning bird kick could be renamed the Vega Blender. you can sometimes score FA's on her but her back dash is like vega's fwd dash, and RCF can punish a few of her moves. EX CRF punish her fireball which she often throws out at mid screen, but not if she has an ultra. stay on the ground and use only short recovery moves when she has an ultra. the LP SHC seems to catch her in the air quite alot. There is ALOT more to write about this matchup. I can see why she's vegas Rival, but i have yet to really determine which attributes of Vega specifically make him her Rival, is Vega even ChunLi's Rival too? Can we get some input from Chunli Mains as to why they think Vega is Chun Li's Rival?? (which fighting characteristics, not storyline)


Crimson Viper

her little cell-phone zap is the worst thing she can really do to vega, and she can do it 3 maybe 4 times in a row. couple one of those with her Ultra and you're probably dead. all of her othr moves vega can throw her right out of, even her EX spinning 3 hit to flaming pants ones, the key is just to jump through the flames and air throw her, jumping towards her with off-the-ground air throws. The catch to this is that you will usually eat a few cell-phones in the butt in the process. LP and HP CRF are good for catching her in her recoveries, as she's a character that uses almost all special moves, most of her moves leave her open to a ground throw or kara throw.


Dhalsim

EX CRF and EX SHC for his flaming bad breath. pre-empt his FA's with your own, jump and strike forward (now backwards) or up when he locks you into his combo, or go right to backslashes. i've only played a few real good dhalsims and enjoyed every minute of it, when he disappears get on the move with FBA, flips, or SHC's, etc.


E. Honda

Mighty E. Honda, Jumping Fwd or Bwd with HP for his dives, timing has got to be on, someone said doing it early seems to work better. Generally speaking, I tend to use alot of Jumping HP strikes to HP Cancel HP CRF with Honda and HK & MK strikes with CrMP. he is a defensive player so dont expect Cosmic heel to help much, it'll most likely land you in the middle of sumo slaps chip damaging you to death, or deadly Command throw. Don't perform your Ultra unless you're sure you are going to hit, if he also has an ultra. Your Ultra Can beat his Ultra if you execute it the same time he finishes his cutscene if your close, Jumping back with HP is probably a better escape then a Back slash because of his dive and slaps. the brief stall to ST works, but his high damage output makes it risky


El Fuerte

go ahead and pretend he's vega and go for all the airthrows and air strikes you can get, he can throw you out of your aerials as easily as Chun Li or Guile, Cosmic Heels have a good chance of landing after a blocked splash, a Fwd dash to throw is also in the cards for a mystical Vega user. in most cases you'll want to try and beat out his splashes and throws with airthrows off the ground. Air throws which throw a frame or two before you hit the ground or as you are leaving are generally the most effective.,

I'll finish these other characters another time. let's keep adding more, we're getting around to a good Vega guide here

Guile
Ken
M. Bison (Dictator)
Rufus
Ryu
Sagat
Seth
Vega (Claw)
Zangief
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Re: My attempt at a matchup guide.

Postby TommyTwoTime77 » Mon Oct 19, 2009 11:50 am

Gen main here

Gen -vs- Blanka

Do not go to the air in this match-up

Vertical balls and rainbow balls beat Gen in the air

Wait for Blanka to land and punish

Horizontal balls can be stuffed if timed right, I try to use S. Fk or C. Fp (both Mantis) for the far hitbox to lower the chance of a trade

Don't cross-up on wake up unless it is really deep

Cross up early to bait electricity and punish

Far C. Fk (Mantis) and Close C. Lk (Crane) will usually beat out electricity as long as you are not right on top of him

Blocked horizontal balls can be punished with Fp Mantis Super and Mantis Ultra

S. Mp ~ S. Mk xx Hp Hands ~S. Mk xx Hp Hands will not connect correctly on him because of his hitbox

If Blanka attempts a random ultra and you are in Crane with meter do an EX wall kick > Ceiling drop > Land behind him to escape
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Re: My attempt at a matchup guide.

Postby Peffico » Wed Dec 02, 2009 12:19 am

I sent this to cold fusion today why not copy pasta?

Seth Match Guide

Vs Akuma

You would be surprised at how even this match is. Akuma's low health put's Seth in a weird spot. As in this match can really go either way. Seth's long combos can do a great deal of damage (which is new for him), but watch out for Akuma's combos as they will near destroy you.

Akuma's air fireballs can be punished by Seth's super or ultra. If you are quick try a teleport behind him into an easy combo due to landing lag on the air fireball.

Do not use the super for the red fireballs as they beat it. You can use the super to punish normal fireballs though. I would also be weary when Akuma has ex meter as his ex dive kick can hurt and if done right can not be punished by Seth's ultra, however it can be by your light super if timed right. Stick with a teleport or if you can react to it; any srk besides the light will beat it. Guess right and maybe jump back :punch-hard: will not trade.

If all Akuma does is jump back and throw fireballs just focus absorb until you have ultra and punish after. (mostly used for people who think they can out turtle Seth not named Dhalsim)

VS Zangief (Since it's easy)

Oh the greatest of all counter matches in SF4. And guess what?! It's actually in your favor wahooooooo!!!!

NEVER NEVER EVER GET CLOSE. Lariat can be punished by; standing :punch-hard: , tandem engine (careful though), super, or ultra. If you are knocked down your best bet to get away is a backwards teleport or an ex srk. Any srk besides light will beat most of Gief's jump ins.

Zoning with pokes and Sonic boom is the most recommended way of keeping gief out (is there any other way?)

When cornered be careful of The Red Cyclones jumping :joystick-down: :punch-hard: . One counter hit and you are dizzy. And if Gief has ultra after the dizzy; the match is over plain and simple. A Zangief match will be a true test of patience, but you must not give in. Hit and run all the way in this match. This match may take all 99 seconds to win but, can be lost in 5.

Remember Seth is all about opportunity, zoning, and tricks (a lot of tricks)
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Re: My attempt at a matchup guide.

Postby cowboy_soultaker » Mon Jan 11, 2010 9:43 am

If anyone is taking requests, I'd personally like to see a fei long guide. My brother, who is maining Dhalsim, I'm sure would get some use out of a Dhalsim match-up guide (I'm trying to talk him into joining >.>)

If I personally had any information to share I would do so, but I am not such an expert on these things.
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Re: My attempt at a matchup guide.

Postby seanomega » Sat Jan 16, 2010 9:29 pm

I have learned the secret to beating any character with any character...... epic music plays da na na da da dooo, IT's....da de daA..... DON"T GET HIT! I hopes this helps. :D
"I will not fight on PSN. I will not bout on XBL. I'm in the country, don't you see? No SF online for me."
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Re: My attempt at a matchup guide.

Postby cowboy_soultaker » Sat Jan 16, 2010 9:53 pm

seanomega wrote:I have learned the secret to beating any character with any character...... epic music plays da na na da da dooo, IT's....da de daA..... DON"T GET HIT! I hopes this helps. :D

IT'S THE FINAL COUNTDOWN!!!!!!! Who can lose when listening to that song?
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